There’s a bit of me in all the characters, says Cannes winner Payal Kapadia

I loved the way you use documentary footage to set things up.

I think I really enjoy the freedom that nonfiction gives us. To just be able to have a small camera and shoot without a lot of expectations that you’re going to get something out of it. In fiction, because the time is less and there’s a lot of money and people involved you must make it, come what may. I like a little bit of trial and error.

‘I like my characters to speak several languages’

The scene with the stranger washed ashore in Ratnagiri reminded me a lot of the cave sequence in Passage to India in terms of the play between the real and the imagined. How did you conceptualise it?

I was thinking a lot about it being a contemporary folktale, there’s a fable-like quality where the second part is not very realistic. Like in our folktales where we can have a man suddenly turn into a tree or a ghost. I was thinking about the cooker (that Nurse Prabha (Kani Kusruti) gets) as an object. Almost like a genie, she manifests the stranger through it. The restrictions that she has put on herself are internalized patriarchy. So, to deal with it she only needs to manifest it. She needs to literally say this to her own inner demon who is this stranger/husband. She married somebody but they were not close and didn’t live together for long enough. So, he was a stranger to her. I thought that this would be a nice way for her to be with her own inner demons.

My thought was also that a lot of times, female friendships are marred by the internalized patriarchy that pits us against each other. It has nothing to do with us, but we are conditioned to feel a certain way about somebody else’s way of life: that person shouldn’t have it because we didn’t have it. I see myself also sometimes reacting in ways that I think are strange. Prabha must spit it out to be able to accept her friend Anu (Divya Prabha).

How did you conceptualise and shoot the intimate scenes?

It was something that we really discussed and thought about a lot. It was very collaborative. We had an intimacy coordinator on set which was fantastic. Naina Bhan is also an actress; she’s acted in the Netflix series, Ashim Ahluwalia’s Class. We had discussions with her about how we felt about it, and that whatever was going on in the characters’ minds at that time would decide the shot-taking. It’s about Anu experiencing something and her feelings are more important than anything else. So, through these discussions then, it became very clear what we needed to shoot, and how. My editor, Clement Pinteaux, is also very sensitive. There’s a gentleness in terms of how he likes to work. I think there is a lot of him also in how the scenes have turned out.

Now to what everyone in India is talking about—the advantages and disadvantages of co-productions.

In India, for a lot of people, it is tough to get access to funding. But now, with student exchanges, a lot of people from FTII (Film and Television Institute of India, Pune) have gotten opportunities to work with co-productions abroad.

I wish that there was a way that more people could access the co-production system because language becomes a barrier. We also need to have good Indian producers who can do the co-productions. I’ve also realized now, after working with Thomas Hakim and Petit Chaos, that there’s a lot of creativity involved in production. We watch similar films; he is very understanding of the ideas that I have. There’s a lot of back and forth. I take his opinion very seriously. And it’s a nice way to work. So, the idea that a producer just brings in the money for me changed after meeting them.

Many young, indie filmmakers would like to know how to crack the co-production code.

There is no code. It doesn’t happen very quickly. You must be patient. It’s a process and it’s all about whether you want to give into that process or not. Now, in India, a lot of people started funding their own films. And if you’re getting some freedom to do that, then it’s good to do that also, but I love structure. I like to have somebody to submit something to. I’m like a schoolgirl. It depends on who you are, and the kind of personality you are. I am self-employed, there’s nobody sitting on my head to say that I must do it. I could just completely get waylaid and not do anything, but Thomas would be insistent—we have a deadline.

French producer and an Indian filmmaker coming together for a film in which the characters are from Kerala, Maharashtra. It’s a true melting pot. Is this the way the cinema needs to evolve?

I like my characters to speak several languages because I don’t feel rooted anywhere. I feel like I’m a little bit of this and that. I’ve lived a little there, a little here. My friends come from everywhere. And I admire a lot of films from Kerala. They’re also the ones who show my films the most.

There’s so much of your institute, FTII, in Cannes this year. Santosh Sivan has been given the Pierre Angenieux tribute. Maisam’s film is showing in ACID and he is your batchmate. Chidananda Naik’s short has won the top award at LaCinef…

Lots of interesting things are happening around India. I’m also thrilled about Dominique Sangma’s Rapture releasing in France. He is a great filmmaker. Also, these films are from different regions. Meghalaya, Ladakh, Karnataka. Mine is in Malayalam, Hindi, and Marathi. 30 years ago the film in competition here was also in Malayalam. That’s what state support does.

So, would you opt for state support?

If it’s autonomous then yes.